Anthony and Rebecca Holland: Breaking Free and Their Journey of Transformation

SRIDHAR KRISHNAMURTI: Hey, everybody. Welcome to an episode of How to Be a Real One Percenter. Uh, this is a podcast where we're redefining what it means to be successful, not the just unending drive for one type of success externally at the cost of everything else. But it's about living the life you were really born to live, having all the success that you love, and also being really happy on the inside as well and having that internal success. Really delighted to, uh, invite my guests, uh, multiples, our first couple, uh, on the call. So, I'm really delighted to, uh, uh, welcome to the call, uh, to the podcast Anthony and Rebecca Holland. So firstly, thank you guys for being here. Uh, I really, um... I attempted this twice, haven't we? And it's really great to have this happen, uh, the second time. But, uh, really appreciate you both being here. So, thanks very much for, for agreeing to do the podcast.

ANTHONY HOLLAND: Uh, thanks for having us. Good to be here.

SRIDHAR KRISHNAMURTI: Great. Well, look, uh, I, I think, um, we just start this one out by the miracle of this actually happening in the first place cause we'll just jump right in, Anthony. You know, I think, um, you know, for you to be here is, you know, this is all about breakthroughs, right? This, this whole podcast is really about, you know, what's holding us back in life and what happens if we break through that. What, what could the different version of our life be?

And when we first met, you know, to think about that you would be here, uh, to me, is, is quite astounding because, uh, you know, hope you don't mind me saying, but you just, uh, you know, you were that guy in the corner of the room that was not going to say anything, right, for a long period of time.  And, and didn't feel comfortable with sharing yourself, right? It was... It became very hard for you. So, to come on a podcast, um, to me, that just says a lot right in itself. So, uh, I want to acknowledge that off the bat.

ANTHONY HOLLAND: Yeah. Uh, definitely was, was a struggle for me to share things though.

SRIDHAR KRISHNAMURTI: Yeah. And you just came so far with that. And to do it, you know, here on a, on a podcast where so many people are going to be benefiting from it, uh, you know, is major acknowledgement right from the start because, you know, we, we have different miracles in life, right? Like we, we do the work and it shows up in different ways for different people. And oftentimes, we feel like it has to be glamorous, you know, has to be this.

But for some people, being able to just share ourselves is, is a miracle in and of itself. And when you can't do that, it's really painful, isn't it? Like when you're, when you're blocked in yourself and so the ability to come out, it's a miracle in and of itself. And I think, you know, that's why I want to acknowledge that right off the bat. And at the same time, uh, you know, when I think about, you know, you've had your, many of your own, uh, breakthroughs and, and what you've done, Rebecca, with your life. But, uh, another thing I think what's great about having a couple on the, uh, particularly you guys on the call is how important support is. You know when I think about how long has it been now? We're four years in?

REBECCA HOLLAND: Yeah. Nearly five.

SRIDHAR KRISHNAMURTI: Nearly five years in that we've been having these conversations. And, you know, when I think about where Anthony was, which in a moment we'll get a chance to, to hear from both of you. But when I think about the support that you have, uh, had and been in the conversation, which is very much a part of why Anthony's had some of the miracles that we're going to hear about today. So, uh, yeah, just really want to acknowledge you both at the start. And, uh, I think what we'd all love to know is just hear a little bit about your story. Like when you arrived, uh, when we started working together, uh, what was it like for you and what brought you to the work, um, you know, uh, individually and, and as a couple?

REBECCA HOLLAND: Yeah. Uh, for me, it was, um, I had a big problem with drinking, um, alcohol. Um, and I’ve been trying to get help around counseling and, um, even seen doctors, um, uh, taken antidepressants. Um, and then, um... But none of that was working and I was, yeah, pretty on a downhill, downhill spiral, was out of control. And lucky, you know, I’ve got Becks, that she reached out and found you. Uh, and then with the coming to see you and then realising or breaking down the stories that I'd created or the beliefs that I had around myself, um, that was able to understand what problems I had around alcohol and the drinking problem that I, uh, that I had, um, which was, yeah, pretty, pretty bad.

SRIDHAR KRISHNAMURTI: It got to a deep state of like a, like a really, uh, a destructive state in that for personally and, and with your family.

ANTHONY HOLLAND: Oh, yeah. Yeah. And, and, um, yeah. We're, so I was using it to hide or mask the, you know, my problems that I had or not facing things. Um, so, uh, yeah, it got to a point where, yeah, it was, um, sort of, uh, yeah, where I, you know, it could have cost me my life, I suppose.

SRIDHAR KRISHNAMURTI: Yeah. You know, um, I, I share that background with you in terms of my, uh, mine was drugs. And, uh, I’ve shared my story a lot that, you know, I ended up homeless and destitute. And, you know, as we were on the same path, Anthony, you know, when I think about it, uh, you know, on a path to this, this life not lasting for very long. And, you know, I also know what it takes to, to turn that around. And not a lot of people do. So, you know, I think, um, it's just going to be fascinating to hear about what you did. And, but before we go there, I want to dive into the story. Uh, the end of it is, what? Like, uh, uh, you know, let's have a celebratory moment here because it's now been...

ANTHONY HOLLAND: Uh, yeah, what's, um, what are we?

REBECCA HOLLAND: Two weeks.

ANTHONY HOLLAND: In two weeks, it'll be three years.

SRIDHAR KRISHNAMURTI: Three years. I, I'm just hoping everybody just, you know, uh, that's watching this even though we can't see you, that's just, it's some, it's a really, really miracle thing to do. I'm using that word a lot today. It's not something I’ve said a lot, but it's, it's not easy, is it? It's, um, it's a, it's a, once you start on that pathway, it just takes you over. And it's hard to explain how, but you have the best intentions to stop, but it just, it just keeps carrying you, doesn't it?

ANTHONY HOLLAND: Yeah. And, uh, and obviously, now, you know, doing the work with you, it's understanding addiction more now. You know, like addiction's a lot deeper than what people really understand or how they think about it. Um, you know, people think you should be able to just stop, but it's not that, that, it takes over, um, you know. And there's, and there's times where I’ve Like, because for a good year, it was backwards and forwards where I wasn't quite getting or understanding it. And then it had to be, had been, uh, one of the, uh, darkest moments that everything sunk in.

SRIDHAR KRISHNAMURTI: Yeah. And so, what would you say, um, you know, to people out there, because there'll be a lot of people out there that struggle in so many different types of addiction. You know, when, what we've talked about in the past, there's alcohol, there's drugs, but there's all kinds of things. You, you mentioned work. People can get addicted to work. People can get addicted to food of different sorts, you know, get addicted to relationships or sex things, or, uh, they can get even, uh, uh, people get even addicted to things like anger.

So, it's, you know, we get, we can be addicted to so many different things. And, uh, what would you say? Like, because, um, you know, there, there was a period there, uh, where it was a bit of a struggle, going a bit back and forth. What would you say did it for you in the end? Because you definitely had a shift where you just, you, you got it and, and said that's it, right? And it's not been easy, but you've done it. So, what would you say to people that are going, "Hey, what do I need to do if I want to change that?"

ANTHONY HOLLAND: Uh, it's, it's setting yourself up to succeed as well, you know. So, it's, um, putting yourself in the right places or not, you know, not going to certain events or being around certain people. Um, not people, but, uh, you know, uh, like work dos or birthdays, parties, uh, lots of things that I now don't go to because I want to give myself every chance. But also, like with, with my story, it was, it was so easy to fall back into having another drink because you think that was the easy way out, sort of, so to speak. But it's the addiction side which has taken over, you know. So, uh, and the, and the one thing was being committed, you know. Um, I was never really fully committed to it. Uh, so being committed was a, the big part. And then there was understanding the addiction. And it took me that period of time or that year, you know, whatever it was to really understand how addiction, you know, what addiction is.

SRIDHAR KRISHNAMURTI: Yeah. You know, and when I look at you, I think as far as that, that drinking was concerned, excuse me, and where you've gone with it, uh, committed is the word that I would just use. I remember we had some pretty straightforward conversations, right? because you, you had good intentions the whole time. Like you were, you know, really wanted to do it for Becks, you wanted to do it for your kids, you wanted to do it for, you know, these people in your life, which just, but, and while that's a really good intention-It wasn't working because at the end of the day, you remember our conversations of, "Hey, you just... Do you want this for yourself?" Right? And you know, we got to the point where, uh, just like, "Hey, if you don't, then there's no purpose in us continuing these conversations," right?

And you really went away and, and you got there. And, and the... And, and when you did commit, it, you just, there, there was a change, right? And you just, and you've been committed ever since then. And, um, it's something to really celebrate.

ANTHONY HOLLAND: Yeah. There was. And then, and part of that was that conversation, having that conversation with you. See, like, if, you know... There's no, there's not much more you can do for me because you've given me all the tools, and I’ve got to start using them or, you know, in committing to, to this. Um, so that, that, that sunk, that sunk in as well. But yeah. Unfortunately, it took a bit, bit of time to get there, but I got there. Um, and as I say, but, um, still now it's about going, it's putting yourself in the right places and around the right people as well as, um and understanding that, you know, look, you can't just go to one event or I just want to, it's about setting myself up to succeed now as well.

SRIDHAR KRISHNAMURTI: Well, addiction's quite powerful, isn't it? And if you don't have a, a team, you know, if you don't have, uh, that commitment first and foremost, but then a support team, you know, making decisions like, you know, "I'm not going to those places if there's, um, alcohol's going to be there," because why would you?

And, you know, it's, it's, as you say, all of that, that we have to have something really powerful to counter the, the power of that addiction. And it's got to be strong because addiction is, you know, we both know, right? It's extremely powerful. As you, you said it really well, it just takes you over and you get lost in it and start to lose control of... You have good intentions, but you lose control of that.

ANTHONY HOLLAND: Yeah. And that's, uh, part of the addiction I didn't understand is, you know, uh, the thing... You know, for some people think you can just, you know, should be able to just stop, shouldn't be that bad. But that's... Yeah, that's the addiction side of it. It does... It sucks you back in so fast.

SRIDHAR KRISHNAMURTI: That's quite important, I think, to talk about because, you know, a lot of times people think, uh, you know, when people are addicted to alcohol or drugs or anything, like they're a bad person, right? And I think it's quite important to know how that person under there has really good intentions usually, they're just lost.

It's a big difference. And it's, it's frustrating for people that are in, in, you know, their lives anyway. But it is important to just know, uh, that's... That person's not doing that intentionally. Once they become addicted, it's, they're lost in it. So, uh, you mentioned earlier, uh, that you made a tie between the stories. So, we started to discuss, you know, why are you, why are we addicted? Because people just think we get addicted to a substance. But one of the things we discussed is, that's actually not true. It's not addicted to a substance, we're addicted to all the things that we're, believe that we're driving, deriving out of it.

So, and those things are related to how we're feeling inside, right? And the stories that we have. So, uh, for what you're willing to share, what did you discover about the story? Because people are out there, if they're addicted, uh, or even if they're not and they want to understand it, they might say, um, how do stories link to addiction? So, uh, what can you share with us that you found about how the story links?

ANTHONY HOLLAND: Yeah. For me, it was... The big thing was, uh, breaking it down with this... You know, after, after meeting you and going through that whole thing of the stories, you know, and the beliefs that we created was, it goes right back to my childhood, um, around my dad, um, where I grew up. Um, um...

SRIDHAR KRISHNAMURTI: This is about your dad, right?

ANTHONY HOLLAND: Yeah.

SRIDHAR KRISHNAMURTI: Yeah. So, something kind of major happened with your dad recently, right?

ANTHONY HOLLAND: Uh, yeah. Uh, my belief was, um, my dad didn't care. Uh, didn't love me. Um, sorry.

SRIDHAR KRISHNAMURTI: No, don't be. This is, um, this is all about being real, Anthony. And this is the kind of feelings that people have. And I just want to stop and say your courage is just going to make a difference to so many people, because this is the kind of thing people have going on but don't talk about. And for you to come on this podcast and share it as openly and honestly as you are, man, that's just pure courage. So don't apologise. This is like, we all be thanking you for this honesty, you know? And I hope that you pave the way for other people to get honest about what's actually going on with them. Because there's a lot of people stuffing in a lot of things. But I think your emotions really have to do with that. Your dad recently, uh, passed. And...

ANTHONY HOLLAND: Yeah. Um, yeah. So, you know, it's still kind of raw and emotional, um, but it's, uh, through you know, through the work we've done, it gave me ability to be able to reach out to my dad myself and break down those boundaries and, uh, and then understand them. And then it was, uh, and that time we did, um, I reached out and he's got to meet his grandkids. Well, he got to talk to them. Um, and unfortunately, um, uh, May last year, he passed away.

SRIDHAR KRISHNAMURTI: Yeah. Yeah. But, you know, um, how many people, because, because of that story, you know, we spoke about, you didn't speak to him for a long time. And there's a lot of people out there, Anthony, that that's how they feel. They have a judgment about their parent or a loved one and they just cut off from them. The number of times I’ve seen people where that's happened. And the thing is, is that, you know, oftentimes when those people die, we never, those people never did get a chance to say it. But, you know, I know because we spoke about it, you didn't just get to talk to him, you got to say what there was to say and get complete with him, didn't you? Like, to, to, to let him know, "Hey, This is who I knew you really were in my life."

ANTHONY HOLLAND: Without doing the work there, I would've never have reached out to him. And, and, uh, and one of the things I do is I just called him and just said, like, um, uh, I kind of, I was at work when I made the call this morning but, and I, um, I love him and I forgive him for everything. I can't remember exactly how it went. Um, and he was like, probably just about crashed his car. I was, he was so shocked. Um, um, but that just opened the door. And it wasn't, it was part of my, um, my journey and my chapter of closing or breaking down those stories and, you know, and the beliefs that I'd created even though they, none of them were true. Um, and it was all link of stuff I heard or listened to other people, but it was what I put on it.  

And, and, and it's good. And that was a big thing then knowing that, so all that bad feeling and all the hatred I had around that, um, was gone.  

SRIDHAR KRISHNAMURTI: And the real change is to you, isn't it? At the end of the day, whether he's here or not here, this has, this freed you up to, to live your life. Because when we feel that way towards a person, we've holding on to that inside and it's ruining our lives, right? We're filled with the hatred. We're filled with the resentment. And, you know, we're, we're, um, it doesn't feel good. Like if you imagine if he, if he, you know, he had died and you hadn't spoken to him, how would that feel now, right? Because once, I mean, you can still, you know, complete when someone's died, but it's not the same as when you have the opportunity to say it to them now and, you know, while they're here and you did, right? You'll, you'll never, that will never be taken away from you. You will always know that that's what you did, right? And, and he died knowing, being complete, you know, uh, you being complete with it.

ANTHONY HOLLAND: Yeah. Yeah, definitely. Um, so the feeling if I hadn't reached out and, and done that, it would be a lot worse, you know. Um, well, a lot harder to stomach or live with, um, and, but also, I gave him the chance to meet his grandkids, even though it was only over a Zoom call. We never actually got to go up and meet him. Um, but he was proud as punch.

REBECCA HOLLAND: He had pictures, didn't he? Of the kids that we'd sent him. He'd print them out and put them on his, below the TV.

So to get to actually see them and talk with them and connect with them. So, that is what addressing your story, that is what courage does, right? You know, we talk a lot in our work about ego. And ego is [15:56 inaudible] I use it a little bit differently. But for me, ego is an identity. But it is still like when we get into that identity, it's about I am right. You know, somebody is wrong. We have to pass the blame. It's your fault that I'm feeling the way that I'm feeling. And what ends up happening is we, you know, we distance from these relationships. We don't have them. And then there's been numbers of times where people have died.

You know, I completed with my parents. They're both, um, they both died a number of years ago. And, you know, I had a similar story, you know, my mom didn't love me and they loved my brother more than they loved me. And, um, I’ve shared this story in the past and it was like, you know, that's what got me on into addiction as well. Like, um, the drugs and all of that. And when I work and I carried that story, like, you know, through my twenties and when I woke up to, to it, I went and said to them, Hey, I just had this whole complete missed picture of you and I apologise for it, you know, and I thanked them for who they were and when they died, look, I mean, obviously miss them and would love to see them, but I just, I feel complete, you feel complete inside.

Cause you know, you know, what would have happened had I not said that, you know, that we take those feelings forward. So, this is massive stuff that you're talking about here. And, you know, had you not got committed, had you not done the work because, uh, on our, uh, last episode we had Kaushik who does the filming, uh, and he just talked about, you know, fear and how to get over fear and what happens when you do. And most people just keep that fear, you know, they just, they hold onto it and they, they don't do it. They don't have that courage to, to make that move, but just, you know, look at what it opened up for you and for your father, for your family, for you, you know, for your children, uh, for Becks, you know, uh, that just changed the whole dynamic.

So, um, yeah, I use, uh, the word gold has to come out because what I'm hoping here from, from those of you that have done the work and are, are, um, you know, kind enough to come on the show on the, on the podcast, you know, to share some of the gold nuggets. And this is, man, this is like, this is gold bar stuff here because we go through our life and don't do that. And then we wake up one day and say, well, that person's gone. I never said to them what I wanted to say to them. I, I held onto a story about them that was never true and it ruined the relationship, you know? So, this is big stuff.

So, can you say a little bit more, uh, about you said they're not true, right? Because when you, uh, about the stories, right, you said your dad didn't love you. So, um, and also, I think it's important to mention that you didn't feel good about yourself when you believe that, right? Of course, if we believe our parents don't love us and, you know, you grew up in a place that you thought wasn't the best place or whatever, and you had judgments about that, then it lowers your self-worth that, you know, how, how worthy you believe you are. So, um, what can you say about, uh, what'd you do to, uh, you don't have to go through the whole thing, but just in a general way, what'd you do? Cause people go, well, how'd you get past that story, those stories?

ANTHONY HOLLAND: Um, the stories, you know, say it was the belief around my dad or where I grew up, um, I was working through it and talking through it and then breaking it down that, no, that the, you know, these are stories that I’ve made up, um, and that, that they're not true and that, uh, you are good enough, um, there's still moments where you have those thoughts like creep back in. So, it's, it's being able to catch those moments and, and say, and say, no, is this true or not true?

SRIDHAR KRISHNAMURTI: But they're patterns, aren't they? They're patterns that you would have decided way back then. You decided, A, your dad didn't love you, B, from whatever house you grew up in or whatever that meant you weren't worthy or whatever the story is. And I'm not making light of that. We all have these stories created a long time ago when you didn't even know that you did it. And so, they become patterns, right?

But you, you know, um, without going too much into it, you really went deep and started to shift those stories. Right. And so, you get a big leap. And then when they do come back, you're like, ha ha, I know what you, I know what this is. I'm not buying into you this time and I'm moving forward and connecting. And it's, it's obvious. You don't even need to say anything about what your genuine self is like, because when you, when you address those stories, what you get is your, you start being your genuine self. We're just seeing it, right? Do we need to even say anything? Cause here it is right here. The honesty and openness, you know, um, next, you know, for years, why Anthony just, you know, I think it surprised you when he came out and shared that time.

Remember I was in a, in a group and he just came out and shared the whole thing because you had gone through a whole year, Anthony. Remember, uh, you went through a whole year and didn't, cause it was this powerful group that you were a part of really awesome people, but he was, I didn't, you know, I didn't want to force anything, but it was the end of the year. And I was just like, Anthony, you haven't said anything you've got like, cause I think you were just coming up on just over a year or something at that point, uh, sober.

And you just, and then when you did share, I mean, it was just like, there was Anthony, right? The real one. And you've been, you know, um, getting more and more of him over time. So it's just been super inspiring to, to watch your journey in, you know, three years, uh, is, is an extreme accomplishment, but for what I see of you, you're just starting and there's so much more to come about how, um, improvements in your life and everything that you're working towards are improvements, but, you know, having more of the life, more and more of the life that you really want and designing it. So, um, yeah, just want to really say thanks for, for you coming in and sharing the story.

We might come back to you as well, but, uh, when I go to Becks here for a moment, because when, um, in the beginning, uh, you know, uh, you, you shared that it was quite a low point for you and, uh, you know, one of your saving graces, if I'm sure you won't mind me saying this is that, uh, uh, lovely lady and partner of yours on your right hand side there, uh, you know, showed up with you and was there, you know, every step of the way. And so, as a, in the beginning Becks, you came to, uh, to support Anthony, right. And you were just there and, and, uh, and, and you're a massive support for him.

But then all of a sudden, uh, we, we started to have some conversations as well. All right. Cause the work can apply to everyone, right? Like it's, uh, we all have things that, that, that if we can address them, you know, these blocks that we may not even know that we've got, but if we address them, you know, your version of connect to more of your genuine self. And that just has, you know, when I say that, so people are like, what do you mean? Like you connect with who you really are. It's hard to say, but then everything in your life starts to flow.  

REBECCA HOLLAND: But because we were doing the work together, we're so entwined, like he would step up, but I'd still be here. So, then I'd have to meet him here, even though it was his journey, I had worked to do myself. And if we didn't meet in the middle, then it wasn't going to go anywhere. And he wouldn't go any further because I would have been weighing him down or vice versa. Just because everything is all entwined, which I guess is natural when you're in a relationship.

SRIDHAR KRISHNAMURTI: That's the important thing that you're saying, right? Because there's patterns that happen between people. So, we have our own patterns. So, for example, Anthony, you've got, um, you grew up with, I'm not loved. And if you, if you didn't believe you were loved by your parents, who's your whole world, you know, um, your mom and your dad, your whole world at that age, then you believe that, well, I deserve that. And, you know, it just goes on. The story goes on. I must deserve it. I'm not good enough. There's something wrong with me. There's all different versions of it. So that's what you bring to the relationship, right? And then you'll have your story. We all have our story, right? And then, um, and, and that will interact.

And so, when Anthony was breaking out of that story, you, I love what you're saying that this is, I'm just so great that, that you're on together because we haven't had to, we haven't had a chance yet to address this dynamic. It's like, Anthony's now here, but your dynamic is still in that whole pattern and it just doesn't work. Does it? It's like, oh, wait, it's almost like, where's that other person that was engaged in that pattern with me? And so, yeah, you know, you had the courage to start looking at, Hey, what? What’s my part?

Right. And, and it's important to know that when there's a problem going on, it can be like in the case of addiction or other things, it can, we can, it can look like one person has the issue, but it's actually, there's two people involved, right? There's always the two sides of it. And, uh, that's why I just have so much, uh, um, uh, respect and just, uh, I don't know what the word is. Um, yeah, just, just, uh, inspiration from you to really about that. You both showed up and, you know, you're both, uh, doing the work to the, to, you know, you showed up with a complete willingness to, uh, to do it, you know. Well, it took a little bit for the complete willingness, but you definitely got there and, uh, and, and actually you just started to come along.

So, and interestingly, um, you know, some of the things that you, uh, that you did were about the relationship and about assisting at them, but then we started to discuss some things just about your own life and your own journey. So, uh, love to hear from your story as well as to, you know, what's, uh, what's something in the work that's made a difference for you and maybe just a bit of your story about, you know, what started to happen when, when you began to do the work yourself and the work that we do here.

REBECCA HOLLAND: Yeah, aside from obviously helping ants and the sobriety side of it, it was learning and I didn't realize it. I don't know if you made me aware of it, but we started discussing like my dad and abandonment and stuff like that. And then I think I only did one or two sessions about it and it just clicked and everything unraveled. Like, and the key words were, cause I was very young when my parents separated and the key words that you said is he just left, he didn't leave you, he just left. And as soon as like, I said that in my head, it was everything just unraveled.

It just, but it unraveled like stuff between us, stuff like earlier on, like everything just unraveled. Like with his drinking, it was like, what did I do? Why is he doing this to me? Why is he leaving me? Made it about me, but it wasn't about me. That was his issue. That was his drinking. And that was just my abandonment insecurities coming out, I guess.

SRIDHAR KRISHNAMURTI: I tell you what, Becks, that time, because people come on this podcast and a lot of times like it's not right or it's not wrong. Something really, really important that you're bringing up here is that when you apply things, it's all really about inquiring into the self. This work is a lot about just self-awareness, really deep self-awareness. And a lot of people come on, it's interesting because you shocked me, right? I was like on the call on the next week. I'm like, okay, we're going to pick up because a lot of times people come on, they talk about how long, you know, not like decades or anything, but like it took a period of time to get through things.  

And, you know, when we'd uncovered that your father had left the family and et cetera, and the way that it happened, you know, like just going to say, hey, see you kind of thing. And you were tiny. You were like a really tiny top from memory. It's, you know, when that thing happens, I'm like expecting, okay, we'll do a few on this, right? And so, we came back. It was, I think we did just one.

REBECCA HOLLAND: It was literally one session because you kept going, surely there's something more to work on. And I'm like, honestly, there's nothing. I don't know what else to say.

SRIDHAR KRISHNAMURTI: And then you said, because so just to describe that a little bit more, when things happen, okay, parents leave, you know, for a number of different reasons, some apparent or will sometimes leave, sometimes both parents leave. And, you know, the child is raised by someone else, a family member, or even, you know, aborting situation or that kind of thing.

And yeah, it's quite important. I just say a little bit more about that because the whole story, like this is what children do, right? You made up a story. Your dad doesn't love you. You made up a story. He left me. What do you say? Made up his people like he did leave me, right? So, the thing is, is that children make everything. This is so important what you're saying. And that's where we started. We all make everything about us. You said that to me, you hurt me. It's like, no, they're just being them. They're just doing what they do. And so, we were doing what was like, look, we were shifting the perspective on that. We were looking at your belief that your dad left you because that, do you mind if I say a little bit about the dynamic and how that worked in addiction?

So, if you feel abandoned, then think about when Anthony's doing what he's doing with addiction, that's just triggering all that abandonment. He's leaving me, right? He's, it's happening all over again. And so, you're charged. And so you can't be that space for, you know, your husband that you really want to be because you're charged because it's going on for you. And when you look, but that's what children do. We make everything about us and we don't even know that we do it. So, if a parent leaves, they didn't leave. They left me. They don't, you know, they're not stressed. They don't love me.

They're not, you know, they have parents have their, you know, we're all parents now. You have your own stuff, you know, going on, right? And you're just doing the best you can. But a child reads that differently. It's, you know, and that's just the way that, that it works at that stage. But the thing is, is that it doesn't stay in childhood. We get to adult, we get, you know, into a partnership or a marriage and it stays. And I think I remember we having this conversation about, you know, there's a two-letter word in that thing that's destroyed a lot of your life. You really thought about it and I said, which word is it?” And you said me.

And that, so you, because your original was, he left me and then you just dropped the me. He just left. And you're right. Cause you came back. I remember now, as you're saying it, you got it with Anthony, you got it with, it was just like with everywhere, wasn't it? You just, the me left the whole story.

REBECCA HOLLAND: 100%. But with that, we also went to a completely different level between us. Like, yeah. And it was really his true genuine self. I think it was about August last year. And it just, yeah. By me letting that go, we both just shot up. So, to speak.

SRIDHAR KRISHNAMURTI: Well, tell us about like, what is, what's the difference? So, what's the difference in that when you say genuine self, cause we use that term a lot. It's one of my favourite terms. It's like, we're, you know, we all run around not knowing usually that we're not being who we really are. We're being run by these stories. So, what was the difference? Like when you, when you say, because I remember it, but it'd be great for all of us to hear. What was the difference as you get into your genuine self-versus story reacting to story?

REBECCA HOLLAND: Some of it's hard to explain because there was like this different connection between us. Like obviously we're husband and wife, but there was a different connection. And I can't explain that connection cause it was next level. Um, but yeah, he just opened up even more. Um, and what else was going on?

Yeah, there was just, I can't, I can't put it into words, the difference, but we were just our true genuine selves. Yeah, I guess maybe cause I’d, I'd let go of all the stories that I was holding onto, which he was entwined in, even though he wasn't the original cause, but I'd made it about me, you know, and that was his sobriety and his drinking. So, I guess me letting that go over the past 18 years of our relationship, just going, well, it's wasn't him, you know, like.

ANTHONY HOLLAND: How freeing is that?

REBECCA HOLLAND: Yeah. I guess it just opened me up more. I guess that's the only way I can describe it. You know, I was more my true genuine self.

SRIDHAR KRISHNAMURTI: And it opened the space for him, right? Because then Anthony didn't have that to react to. He had the space to then get it come into himself. So, it's, it is hard to explain, isn't it?

REBECCA HOLLAND: It's really hard to explain it.

SRIDHAR KRISHNAMURTI: But you're just, you know, one opens the space for the other and then you get more to your genuine self and then the other one opens the space. And this is what we all actually want. What we want in a relationship is connectedness. We want that intimacy, we want connectedness, but it's also, we're afraid of it. When we've got these stories, it's fearful to open ourselves up, right? Like as the way that we can say it here is if you're disconnected with yourself. So, when you guys are believing your stories, you were disconnected from yourself.

So, if you're disconnected from yourself, how can you be connected with another human being? And, you know, when you do connect that way, you're illustrating, which is just absolute gold here is that when you, when we are able to dispel that story for, you know, or disidentify from it, get to the self, we feel more connected with us. And that creates certainly the opportunity for a greater, well, any, even if the other person doesn't do it, you'll feel more connected and it will create more connectedness.

REBECCA HOLLAND: And you're more at peace. Like, I don't know how else to explain it. You're like on the inside; you're more at peace. You're more relaxed. You're more, you're not holding everything in. So, you are more relaxed.

SRIDHAR KRISHNAMURTI: But peacefulness is something that comes with your genuine self, isn't it? Because, because there's nothing to fear. There's no story. You're just you. And you realise, what do I mean, I'm not good enough? What do I mean, I got abandoned. What do I mean? That's just, that's just, just perceptions that I’ve had about the way life, life's just happening. You know, people struggle and they do things. And sometimes that's our parents, but it doesn't actually say anything about us. And then you're free to just be right.

REBECCA HOLLAND: But it took us to that different level of what do we want out of our life? Where do we want to go? What do we want to create? So, it opened up all of that opportunity, you know, like we want to live our life and this is the way we want to do it. And this is where we're going, so to speak.

SRIDHAR KRISHNAMURTI: On that note, there's something I want to, I would love to share because there's something in the work that we've talked about is the ability to create things in your life and how the mind can either help or hinder. Sometimes people look at me a little bit cross-eyed and go, what do you mean the mind has something to do with, you know, creating, but I'm talking about the house. If you're happy to share that, do you remember those sessions around, uh, so you guys were selling your house and you want, you had this beautiful place that you were getting, that was like the family dream, uh, the space that you wanted, you know, for the kids.

We're going to need to say more of that. It was going to be a beautiful house, right? It was the right place that you were going to. Yeah. And I’ve seen it since you've done it. It's a beautiful house now, that's for sure. So, um, yeah, you do remember those conversations because I just remember you saying, “Look, this has not happened because you had some buyers remember. And then that would got, went a little bit pear shaped and I can't remember the belief Becks, but you were like...

REBECCA HOLLAND: I wasn't letting it go. Like, even though I wanted to move forward, I was still holding onto the house. And for me, the attachment was, and I thought I'd let go was when we bought the house, my mom was still alive. And then, so I was like, this is our forever home. And mom was part of us buying it, you know, in 11 years on, it was kind of like, what are we doing here? Like, even though we'd renovated and stuff, I was just like, the kids are getting bigger. We're running out of space. Like this isn't working. And I thought I was like, yep, cool. I'm ready to let go. But I was still holding onto it because I was just like, mom was still part of that house, but she'll be part of wherever I go.

SRIDHAR KRISHNAMURTI: Absolutely. She's in there. Well, I remember the thing was, is that for weeks, because you guys put it on the market, you know, for weeks, just one thing after another wasn't going right. And you're just like, oh, it's not going to happen. And then we, I said, Becks, is there something going on? I remember just saying, hey, is there something going on the surface? And that's when you're just always open and ready to do the work, you know, to, to look at it. And you said, I think I'm holding onto the house. So, we, and do you remember what happened? Just, this is so great. Cause it's such a hard thing to, to describe, but when you go through it, you just never can say it doesn't happen this way.

I remember the day that you, you did that and you said, right, I'm ready to let it go. And then whoosh that the stuff that was the blockages to start to happen, the place that you wanted, you got, and, uh, you guys have done incredible jobs. So, uh, I haven't been there yet, but you've taken me on the phone tour and, uh, you guys have done an amazing job with such a beautiful space that you've created.

And the thing is, is that this is, you know, we, we get past this, what does it open up the opportunity for? So, uh, yeah, again, I'm just so thankful that you guys have coming on this podcast and sharing this story because that's what I want people to know. You know, we go through our lives, um, and you know, I repeat this on occasion, but the reason I'm doing this is, you know, my own moment when I was in Seattle, Washington in the States and looking up at the space needle when I was drugged out and homeless. And that was my first day of being homeless.

And I looked up and saw this tower. And, you know, when I heard those words that, you know, there's an infinite potential for this life, you know, I'm not meant to be down here. I'm meant to be up there, which was a metaphor, obviously. And there was infinite possibility and infinite potential for life. And I just got this vision for what life could be. And, you know, I just so wanted that. I wanted that version. And one of the reasons I'm really dedicated to what I do into this podcast and why I'm so thankful for people, amazing people like you too, for sharing your story, which takes a lot of courage is what versions of life are people living.  

You know, we're stuck in these stories and then we think things aren't going to work out or that we're stuck in our own way of doing things. But when you come here and say, look, by just addressing some of the things that you had been believing, you know, these are the things that are happening. And you guys have accomplished so much in these few years. But I just get the sense that there's just so much more to come. You know, you're just getting started.

And, you know, we were having a chat just before we started about your children because I’ve had a chance to speak with a couple of them, amazing children. Really, you guys have done an incredible job because they're really cool kids. Like, they're just the openness that they have. I can't remember when we had our conversation. So, at least.

REBECCA HOLLAND: Louis was probably about two years ago because it was into Anthony's sobriety. And obviously, yeah, even though I thought I was protecting them, they're children. You know, they might not understand what's going on, but they know things are wrong. And for Louis being the oldest, I guess he was more, what's the word? Like, he was, he saw a lot more, even though I thought.

SRIDHAR KRISHNAMURTI: You could see that he had taken it on, right? He was having the stories about, you know, even though Anthony was going through his problems and you guys were, he was doing the same as the rest. He was taking on that that's about me. They don't love me. And it was just, it just gets passed on. Yeah. And then you're.

REBECCA HOLLAND: Yeah. And even now, like, something will happen and there's still a little trigger there for him. So, we have to sit down and go through the whole process to eliminate it, so to speak, and break it down, you know. And we always explain to the children, if we hadn't have done this, like, they've been exposed to this whole world, you know, of how to break down the story so they can go on into their adulthood and not be carrying any trauma, well, hopefully, not carrying any trauma.

SRIDHAR KRISHNAMURTI: Well, certainly know what to do with it, right?

REBECCA HOLLAND: Yeah.

SRIDHAR KRISHNAMURTI: Because even your youngest, like, you've got a superstar, you know, in the world, the gymnastics, uh, your youngest, uh, Manet, she's, she was...

REBECCA HOLLAND: She's in the middle, yeah.

SRIDHAR KRISHNAMURTI: Oh, she's in the middle. She's in the middle. Sorry, I’ve got them in the wrong way. But, um, yeah, absolutely a superstar. But, you know, the pressures of, on children, the pressures on anyone, you know, because I work with athletes and, um, you know, when they're adults at the highest levels and the, and the pressure that they feel. But when you're a kid, you know, and you've got a talent like that, you know, I remember working with her and just the stresses and pressures that she... Was she eight?

REBECCA HOLLAND: She would have been eight.

SRIDHAR KRISHNAMURTI: Eight when we worked together, you know, and just, you know, you think that they don't know a lot and they're just kids, but when you really feel the failures, they know a lot. They, under the surface, they know, they know what's going on and they feel pressures. And, you know, it's just amazing that you guys have, we're talking about opening the space here is one of the themes I'm getting out of today. And you guys together have opened the space for them. And that's, what's really cool is that they're now able to say, don't imagine what's going to happen, how they're going to live their life differently, knowing that what they believe isn't necessarily true.

Like the limitations are what people, how people judge them. Cause you know, we're all teenagers at some point and we get judged and all, we feel judged and all of that. And what if you had the skills to know, Hey, that's not about me. That's, that's about them. And, you know, I'm just going to, I'm fine. I'm who I’m, I'm great who I am. And, you know, I don't need to, you know, if I succeed great, if I, you know, at that particular thing, great. If I don't, you know what, that doesn't define me as a human being. And what an amazing thing that, you know, if this is a, it just goes on, right?

Like this, uh, I love this concept of space that you brought up, Becks, because when you do your work and you clear yourself, that's precisely what happens and people step into it, don't they? Anthony steps into your space and at a new level, you step into his space. The kids are now doing it and it just, um, it's, yeah, it's, but the opposite is the same. Like if we have negativity, if we have blame that also gets shared, it creates an atmosphere of those things. So, yeah, you two have just done such extraordinary things.

You know, when people, parents come and they do the work, they say, how can I stop my children from getting these stories that I got? Right. And I’ll say that you can't, they're going to get their stories, but what you can do, I’ll say, what can we do to help? I'll say, well, one, you can see it, but two, keep being yourself, keep being your genuine self. And they see that, but you also will recognize when they have a story.

So, you know, your kids are just going to have, uh, just the most amazing opportunity because when, when children have those stories and parents don't recognize that that's what it is, right? We, we, I mean, the things that we actually do, we blow it up. Oh, you don't feel good about yourself. Okay. Well, let's discover all the different ways that you don't feel good about yourself. Like, why don't you just find out that that's actually just not even true at the start and you're great. And let's find out why. And then you get on with it. And, you know, I think about your kids and how you're going to be able to see, you know, how some of them have already seen for themselves. They're bright children, right? Very bright children.

Uh, and, but you'll be able to see when they're onto it and just go, Hey, um, and, and that what happens for them, you know, as they grow up.

I sometimes think about what if someone had told me this when I was, you know, their age and what would have happened, but like, I'm not, uh, about regret or anything and things happen in the right time, but, uh, they're really fortunate kids having you guys as, as parents for sure.  

ANTHONY HOLLAND: Yeah. So, what's the stories you like without saying, I would never even looked at or thought about looking at the stories. No, it was like...

REBECCA HOLLAND: I don't even think you'd be here today.

ANTHONY HOLLAND: No.

REBECCA HOLLAND: You were so far at rock bottom. It wasn't funny.

ANTHONY HOLLAND: Yeah. I, you know, I got into counseling and stuff. I worked to try and think that would help, but there was.

REBECCA HOLLAND: Even the medications, like it, just made them so much worse.

SRIDHAR KRISHNAMURTI: Well, you got to find out the end of the day, you got to find out why is this going on. You know, why is this going on? What's, what's happening inside of here that's got me on the cycle. And if you have the courage like you do, and you both did, then you can start to address it. But the thing is, is once you do, you go, wow, was it that straightforward?

ANTHONY HOLLAND: It all makes sense. I mean, obviously there's still an addiction side, because addiction is still, you know, it does take control. But it gave me a lot of understanding about what stories I believe. Being able to break them down was the start of the journey to really get true and honest with myself.

REBECCA HOLLAND: But it's also the outside world. I don't know if the word adjusting is right, but this is who Anthony is. It's not who Anthony was. They treat him like Anthony was. He's not that person anymore.

SRIDHAR KRISHNAMURTI: And it's not easy, right? When you have people that you love and your friends and your family, and you're saying that to them and they feel hurt, but you know, but you also say, look, we care about you. We're not just going to jeopardize our whole everything, right? Especially where you've been quite open about where Anthony got to, it wasn't a pretty place, right? It wasn't going to last much longer. So, what's worth that? What birthday party is worth jeopardizing that? And, you know, again, that's where commitment, you know, a few things are coming out, which is...

ANTHONY HOLLAND: Well, the big thing I think for me as well is actually being open and honest about it, owning it, you know, like really put it out there, which I'm doing more now to start off with... It's not that I try to hide it. It's... I just wasn't sure how to go about things. And, uh, but then I'm more open to, um, people that say, look, I had a drinking problem or I don't drink. But I'm not, I'm not on the roof preaching at that to everyone, but...

SRIDHAR KRISHNAMURTI: Like, I mean, it just, why wouldn't you, right? Like people feel ashamed of them. I talk about my addiction years all, you know, all the time. It's like, why do you talk so much about them? And I'm like, well, A, uh, I wouldn't be here talking any of this if it hadn't been for that. Like if I hadn't had that experience, I wouldn't be here doing this and B, one of the things I’ve discovered is that we just don't feel like we can talk about everybody's got stuff. This is one of the things I’ve learned in all the years I’ve done my work that, you know, with people is that we all have stuff going on, everyone without exception.

And, but we don't feel that we can talk about it. We have to, you know, particularly now when we feel we have to be this way on social media, etc., I talk about it each week or each episode. Usually, we feel more and more like we have to push ourselves into something that we're not. And, but that's not helpful to us because all we're doing is reinforcing to ourselves. I'm not good enough being who I am. And it's important, you know, to, to, to bring that out. So why wouldn't you be, okay? You know, and, and I always say, look, if, if people are really, you know, it's like, oh, I might lose loved ones. And I'm like, if they're really a loved one who cared about me, that's not going to change it. Right. And if it does change it, how loved one were they in the first place?

REBECCA HOLLAND: Oh, exactly. And that's on them. That's not on you, you know, cause you're just being your true self. You're not being mean or nasty. It's actually not about them. It's about, this is who I am and this, I can't come here. You know, it's not about them. It's about.

ANTHONY HOLLAND: I mean, and sometimes with the addiction and drinking side, a lot, a lot of times have people only seen that fun side, you know, or the life of the party, but there was more to it after that. Which they don't see.

REBECCA HOLLAND: They didn't see the behind the scenes of what was going on.

SRIDHAR KRISHNAMURTI: Which is the down part of the cycle, right? You get the up to, cause you get the addictive thing, the drinking and whatnot to feel better. But the moment you do that, you're on the slippery slope of all the guilt and all the, you know, why did I do that? And all the, yeah, everything. And so, it did. And then we get to that low again. I need the drink again to feel better for a few minutes. And it's a very, very...

REBECCA HOLLAND: You know, and so the up and down, as you know, we talked about was, yeah, definitely. And that's the cycle you get stuck in.

SRIDHAR KRISHNAMURTI: Yeah. It's called the law of diminishing return. So, with addiction, basically you need more. So, over a period of time, you need more of whatever you're having to get less, but the lows get lower. So, the pattern goes, you know, it keeps going down over a period of time. So, the highs get lower and the lows get lower. And so, it just gives you diminishing returns, but we're stuck in it. And it just goes until, you know, until for, you know, fortunate ones like you and me, there's a point where you just, you get that commitment for whatever it took. And, uh, and then everything starts to change, you know, from there.

But, you know, one of the reasons I’m, I’m, uh, so appreciative that you've come and shared your story, both of you is, you know, it's, uh, it doesn't matter where you start. Like you guys are doing some incredible things in your life. And I know you've got, you've got a business, you know, a great business that you've got plans for and are working to, you know, have work in a better way for, for all the things that you want to have. Uh, you've built your beautiful home, you know, you've got your plans for your kids.

And, you know, sometimes though, it's just about, we're not starting from a great place, right? And, and I think people need to know that that's okay. Cause I, I think people sometimes say, I have people contact sometimes that I'm not ready to, I'm not ready to start the conversation. I'm like, um, I don't feel good enough to start the conversation. I'm like, that's precisely when to start the conversation because you're feeling that low. What, you know, um, but people feel ashamed of it. They feel, I, you know, I'm not, um, I, I have to get to a certain point. I'm like, no, we just, honesty is what's required. And that's what you guys are bringing this massive gift today to help people to understand, to help us all to understand that it's okay to be where you're at and just start and get honest about, Hey, this is where things are.

Because what my work has shown me is people might be surprised at just how much people are going through. You know, we don't like to talk about it, but there's behind the scenes, people are just going through a lot. Right. And, and it's important for people to know that's part of life and there's nothing to be ashamed about. It's not an easy gig life, is it? Like it's, it's, it's got a fair bit of challenge going on with it. And, you know, sometimes we handle that really well and sometimes it can get on top of us. And, you know, I just want to say thanks to you both because of your honesty or do you, you know, how honest you're being about the way things were. I'm hoping it gives other people permission to just take an honest look in the mirror and say, Hey, what's actually going on? You know if things are great, fantastic. If they're not hiding it, it doesn't work. Does it? Just running from it? It doesn't work.

ANTHONY HOLLAND: It's a bit vulnerable, we're like, we're all vulnerable and let's just put it out there. You can't hide from it.

SRIDHAR KRISHNAMURTI: Yeah. Yeah. I just watching you, Anthony, just, I can't help but, you know, think of you four years ago, just, you know, I would say, Anthony, say something, Anthony, say something. He's like, you know, as he's covering his face. And now, you know, sharing at this level of vulnerability, I'm just trying to share it because if people could get just how far you can go in your life, you're demonstrating, you know, both of you demonstrating it right here, right in front of us, because to be on this call after what you went through is just, I can't, you know, I'm just going, I'm seeing a whole timeline here of just sitting here with you and it's a miracle.

But I hope what people can take out of it is, I say it all the time and I lived it too, like, it doesn't matter where you are. You have a great life to live, but it's not going to just knock on your door. You've got to say yes to it. You know, it will knock on your door, but most of us aren't listening when it does, but we have to say, yeah, you know what, I'm going to commit to living that one. And when you do, I'm just watching, you know, and for me, it's early, early days, right? Because I, I feel like for me, I’ve been doing this work for 30 years. I feel like I'm just starting, but, you know, when I think about your journey together and what you're doing and individually, you're just starting in some ways, but I think about how far have you already come? And it's just really, really amazing to see.

REBECCA HOLLAND: And that's also remembering the past is the past. The future hasn't happened yet. Yes, you can create what your direction you're wanting to go in or what you're wanting, but here and now is your life. You know, you can't live in the past.

ANTHONY HOLLAND: We can't live in the future either way, so it's got to be, you've got to be present.

REBECCA HOLLAND: You're here and now.

SRIDHAR KRISHNAMURTI: I think what I need to do is get some bottles for this podcast. And when we get gems like that, we bottle that one up, right? Because how many of us live in the past.

REBECCA HOLLAND: And that's where it's hard with friends because they're still looking at Anthony as the drinking Anthony. They're not looking at Anthony as this is who he is now.

SRIDHAR KRISHNAMURTI: And you know, it's interesting, isn't it? So, we move on. This is who I’m. Why is it so, why do we feel so stuck in life that we have to live in a past that this is who I am?

REBECCA HOLLAND: I think because society normalises drinking, but why can't it be, it's normal not to drink?

SRIDHAR KRISHNAMURTI: Well, it's also because we perceive people to be a certain way and that's who we become friends with our perception of the person. And when they change dramatically, we're still dealing with that person. And it's hard to actually move forward with it because we just form the story about, it's another part of the story. They're not in a relationship with Anthony. They're in a relationship with their story of Anthony. So, when he changes, their story doesn't match anymore. And it brings up fear, right? It brings up their own insecurities potentially.

And I’ve found people do one of two things usually. They either go for the ride and they go, hey, you know, it doesn't mean they have to stop drinking or anything like that, but it means I'm going to look at myself and why am I stuck in the past? And why am I, you know, not seeing Anthony doing great things? There's an opportunity to do that. Or you'll, I'm sure you found this out. They'll embed the other way, but then it just usually kind of just naturally, you know, sometimes, sometimes something is over, you know, and, and it's okay. There'll be somebody else there for them. That's more of a match because it's not working anyway.

ANTHONY HOLLAND: Sometimes recognizing that now we understand they have stories as well. So, it's, it's not a problem.

SRIDHAR KRISHNAMURTI: Another bottle moment. You know what? We're going to be here for, we've been here for ages, but I think we actually do have to, unfortunately probably bring this to a close soon, but I guess so many, I'm going to call them bottle moments now, maybe instead of gold, but these, these things that you're saying that it's really important, right? They just have stories too. And once you understand that we stop blaming people, we stop making them wrong. Understand why they are the way they are.

REBECCA HOLLAND: Yeah. Well, when you come from your true, genuine self, you're not coming from a point of anger at them either. You kind of, you just accept them. That's who they are. You know, you don't make it about them. There's, there's nothing there.

SRIDHAR KRISHNAMURTI: And then you move on. Everybody moves, you know, or you, you at least move on. Well, I can't thank you too enough. I think we are coming to the, to the end of this episode, but I have to bring it back. I feel like we were just unpacking quite a bit of stuff. Part two, I think I sense it that we'll have to be a part two here because there is a lot more to say, isn't there? I think.

ANTHONY HOLLAND: Yeah. It's hard to explain it all, but that's the hard part and get it out there. So, I mean, I hope that's all how people will...

SRIDHAR KRISHNAMURTI: Oh, look, I probably have no idea how much somebody is going to listen to this and just, it gives them permission to say, Hey, I can be honest, you know, it's, it's, it's just a massive gift, you know, you two coming on this. Um, so look, I want to say thanks, but is there anything before we finish, uh, that you would say is one thing If somebody was watching this and saying, Hey guys, this work is all about for me, uh, the work that I am involved in is really all about living your best life. It's living the best version of it, which for me means you feel happier in yourself. You feel connected to the word that I'm getting from you to the genuine self, right? That's, that's first and foremost. Otherwise, nothing else matters. No, no amount of external success matters if we're not connected, you know, and into our, being our genuine self. But also, I love all success in life. Like I, I'm actually largely a success kind of coach, right. But, um, or a consultant, whatever you want to call it. Um, and you know, it is about all the success and that.

So if there's somebody out there saying, you know, they're watching this podcast, I'm assuming that's what they're interested in because we're pretty clear about our message here, uh, in this podcast, what would you, what's one thing you would say that like wherever they are now, what would you say to, uh, for them to take a leap and say, uh, what's something that could put into place today?

REBECCA HOLLAND: Accept where you are. And if you're wanting to change, find the stories that you've created in your mind that's caused you to get to where you are. And it's okay that you're there, but break down those stories.

ANTHONY HOLLAND: The thing about knowing is, you know, questioning it, saying, do you know that those things are true? You know, that's honest, you know, is that true and honest and, and really challenge it and really ask those questions. Cause you know, that's when now I understand that is when I start to break those things down and, you know, and there's still daily challenges and stuff like that.

REBECCA HOLLAND: One of our biggest sayings we say to each other, like if Anths comes home and he'll be like, Oh, such and such is thinking this. Do you know that? He's like, no, I don't. And what are you doing in their head? Get out of their head. You know, like, don't worry about what other people are thinking. Like who cares what they're thinking? Like, if you're going to make the change one, you've got to be ready for it. If you're not ready for it, you're not going to do it.  

ANTHONY HOLLAND: You start to love yourself as well. You know, that's where you put everything else first, but put yourself first. Cause you can't, if you don't do that, then you're not, things will, it may happen, but it will take a lot longer to happen.

SRIDHAR KRISHNAMURTI: Yeah. Yeah. One of my examples is you get on the airplane and what do they always say when you have a child, you know, when the oxygen mask, if it drops, place the oxygen mask over yourself first before helping, before assisting others. Right. As if you passed out, you're not going to be able to help your child or anyone.

ANTHONY HOLLAND: I always think that we should be helping everyone else first to feel better. I think feel better about yourself, but you need help first.

SRIDHAR KRISHNAMURTI: I feel like that's just a big exclamation point on this, on what has been an amazing conversation. So, look, we'll bring this to a close, but let me just say like from the heart here, thank you too, for not just being here, but for being as open and honest as you can. That's what the hope for me was on this podcast, that we would just be, we could be a space to be genuine and to share what could happen when you get genuine, when you're willing to look within yourselves. And this has just been an incredible, as I mentioned at the start, it's the first time we've had a couple on that we, I don't know if everyone's going to be like you two, I better keep doing it because this has just been an incredible episode. So, thank you both for, for being here. I really appreciate it.

REBECCA HOLLAND: Thanks for having us.  

ANTHONY HOLLAND: Thanks for having us.  

SRIDHAR KRISHNAMURTI: All right. And thank you for watching. And please join us for our next episode of how to be a real one presenter. We look forward to seeing you next time.